Grain Mill Crush Results

[40oz]

Adjusting my first new 3-roller mill.

Is this where I should/want to be?

 

[jtratcliff]

BIAB or regular mash tun?

I see some intact kernels there... For BIAB, I'd go much finer. Almost flour.
Even for non-BIAB mash, i'd go a little finer... You want *all* the grains
crushed, but not too much flour.

 

[40oz]

Regular Mash Tun

 

[eric19312]

I agree with jet...a little finer. Maybe just a bit finer in a recirculating tun but a fair amount finer if you are mashing in a cooler.

 

[40oz]

View attachment IMG_5718.JPG

Better? Or even more fine?

I use a keggle converted mash tun with a glass bottom and fly Sparge

 

[RM-MN]

Have you read about grain conditioning where you use a bit of water misted or mixed with the grain to soften and toughen the grain husks?

For the best efficiency, you want the smallest grain particles possible but with normal milling and a conventional mash tun this leaves you with shredded husks. You need mostly intact husks to form a filter bed in the tun and the shredded husks just don't work as well. Damp husks don't shred as much so you can have the smaller particles with husks that are still mostly intact.

 

[kh54s10]

The last picture looks better. I would go tighter with my system. But it partially depends on your system. Tighten it up each brew until it is close to, but not giving you a stuck sparge.

 

[eric19312]

View attachment 414894

Better? Or even more fine?

I use a kettle converted mash tun with a glass bottom and fly Sparge

This looks good to me.

 

[Blackdirt_cowboy]

What was the setting on your last crush? I too just bought a three roller monster mill. I have set it at .030", but have not had a chance to run any grain through it yet to see how that will do.

 

[mongoose33]

I don't think it's fine enough, not for mash tun, not for BIAB. I still see what appear to be several uncrushed kernels.

The rule of thumb usually seems to be the gap should be the thickness of a credit card, or about .035. That's for using a mash tun.

For BIAB I'm down to .020. Doing those two gaps and methods produces, for me, the same yield.

************

What I also do is I always crush twice. That helps crush any kernels that might have slipped through the first time.

I usually expect to see at least some flour when I crush.

 

[40oz]

Sorry to keep posting it appears my caliper is dead and I have a few credit cards with different thicknesses.

This next pic and setting seems it might be too low of a setting?

I know not to go by the marking on a mill but this is about a 1/8" below .032 on my Kegco mill

Are those husks too broken up?

View attachment IMG_5732.JPG

 

[40oz]

Alright, so got a new caliper and here is .031 on 2-row.

This acceptable?

View attachment IMG_5735.JPG

View attachment IMG_5733.JPG

 

[dsaavedra]

The most recent 2 pics look the best of any of them to me. The husks aren't obliterated but your grain is definitely well-crushed into small particles. I'd give it a shot and brew a batch with that setting and see what kind of efficiency you get. Have you brewed all grain batches on your system before getting this grain mill? That would help if you had a kind of baseline efficiency to compare the efficiency of the batch you brew using your mill.

 

[mongoose33]

That looks a lot better to me.

If you're not doing so, double-crush it. The second time through is very fast, and you'll get some of the kernels that snuck through the first time.

The crush is important, but I also found that if I stirred the mash well at 15 and 30 minutes, my yield went up again. So that's now standard for me--double-crush, and stir at 15 and 30.

 

[40oz]

The most recent 2 pics look the best of any of them to me. The husks aren't obliterated but your grain is definitely well-crushed into small particles. I'd give it a shot and brew a batch with that setting and see what kind of efficiency you get. Have you brewed all grain batches on your system before getting this grain mill? That would help if you had a kind of baseline efficiency to compare the efficiency of the batch you brew using your mill.

Thanks for the feedback. I use to use the mill from my supplier when I would buy grains, but he's since out of business so this is my first time doing it myself

That looks a lot better to me.

If you're not doing so, double-crush it. The second time through is very fast, and you'll get some of the kernels that snuck through the first time.

The crush is important, but I also found that if I stirred the mash well at 15 and 30 minutes, my yield went up again. So that's now standard for me--double-crush, and stir at 15 and 30.

I'll have to try the double crush.

I fly sparge.....so, are you mashing and then 30 mins in stirring, and then again 15 minutes before you sparge? I thought I should do something like this but was never sure if it was good to do. If that's what you're saying then I need to try that. It always looks like there is so much that is left behind and never rinse into my kettle

 

[SoCal-Doug]

I could go a tad bit finer, but I'm getting a pretty consistent 85% to 86% mash efficiency. I never stir after the initial dough in stirring. Not sure how you are set up, but I use the "hose swirly inch of wort above the grain bed" type circulation and sparge. I don't do the "drippy spray dribble whatever" thing method.

 

[doug293cz]

...

I fly sparge.....so, are you mashing and then 30 mins in stirring, and then again 15 minutes before you sparge? I thought I should do something like this but was never sure if it was good to do. If that's what you're saying then I need to try that. It always looks like there is so much that is left behind and never rinse into my kettle

Stirring at intervals during the mash can improve conversion efficiency.

Your mash efficiency is made up of two factors - conversion efficiency (percentage of available starch you convert to sugar) and lauter efficiency (percentage of the created sugar you collect in your BK.)

Mash efficiency = conversion efficiency * lauter efficiency
Lauter efficiency = mash efficiency / conversion efficiency​

Knowing whether your conversion eff is low, your lauter eff is low (a concern you expressed in the quoted post), or both, let's you know what you need to fix in order to to improve your overall efficiency. You can measure your conversion efficiency using the method here. Most brew software will calculate you mash efficiency, given your grain bill, pre-boil volume and pre-boil OG (or your post-boil volume and post-boil SG, if you didn't add sugar during the boil.) The post boil numbers are often more reliable due to difficulties getting uniform wort concentration pre-boil. Then once you know your mash and conversion efficiencies, you can calculate your lauter efficiency using the equation above.

Low conversion efficiency is improved with finer crush and/or longer mashes. Low lauter efficiency is fixed by improving the sparge process (elimination of channeling, etc.) Conversion efficiency should be better than 90%, better than 95% is good, and 98% or better is excellent. For fly sparging your lauter efficiency should be better than the solid orange line in the chart below. If it is not better, then you would be better off batch sparging. A well conducted fly sparge should be able to do better than the solid green line. Note that as grain bills get larger relative to the pre-boil volume, lauter efficiency drops off.



Brew on

 

[SoCal-Doug]

That's some awesome info, Doug!!! Goals and things to try on future brews.

 

[40oz]

Stirring at intervals during the mash can improve conversion efficiency.

Your mash efficiency is made up of two factors - conversion efficiency (percentage of available starch you convert to sugar) and lauter efficiency (percentage of the created sugar you collect in your BK.)

Mash efficiency = conversion efficiency * lauter efficiency
Lauter efficiency = mash efficiency / conversion efficiency​

Knowing whether your conversion eff is low, your lauter eff is low (a concern you expressed in the quoted post), or both, let's you know what you need to fix in order to to improve your overall efficiency. You can measure your conversion efficiency using the method here. Most brew software will calculate you mash efficiency, given your grain bill, pre-boil volume and pre-boil OG (or your post-boil volume and post-boil SG, if you didn't add sugar during the boil.) The post boil numbers are often more reliable due to difficulties getting uniform wort concentration pre-boil. Then once you know your mash and conversion efficiencies, you can calculate your lauter efficiency using the equation above.

Low conversion efficiency is improved with finer crush and/or longer mashes. Low lauter efficiency is fixed by improving the sparge process (elimination of channeling, etc.) Conversion efficiency should be better than 90%, better than 95% is good, and 98% or better is excellent. For fly sparging your lauter efficiency should be better than the solid orange line in the chart below. If it is not better, then you would be better off batch sparging. A well conducted fly sparge should be able to do better than the solid green line. Note that as grain bills get larger relative to the pre-boil volume, lauter efficiency drops off.

View attachment 415404

Brew on

That's a lot of good info I'm going to have to let sink in.....and it appears it's time I'm going to need some software.

Thank you for that!