I've been going all out on cider lately and have been using supermarket apple juice and concentrates (for back sweetening). Right now I'm using 24oz of cheap FAJC to sweeten a 6 gallon batch. My friends say my current recipe is like "bud light of ciders" and "can drink this all day" and they really love it but I'd like to step it up. I'd like to get big complex apple flavor so I ask if anyone has a recommendation for a high quality FAJC.
Which FAJC is best?
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No such thing as a complex FAJC. I use it for sweetening too, but the flavor of my cider comes from the apples it was pressed from. The sweetening is a very small piece of that. Next year I'll make my own concentrate by freezing the same juice I started with.
Thanks. Kind of what I though but was hoping for a short cut or second way to make it better. Time to hunt down some good apples this October!
Silver79
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As far as frozen concentrate goes, old orchard has the best flavor profile for backsweeting, according to my friends and I. But like was already said, the best flavor comes from the pressed apples. I have had great luck using old orchard's apple cherry blend to give a subtle hint of cherries in the keg. Helps the color too.
homebrewer_99
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I mostly use Old Orchard too...
Store bought juice is made for drinking, not fermenting, and usually lacks the bitters, sharp and tannins that you fet from cider apples.
That aside, I think your yeast selection and fermentation process is key to your flavor profile. Slower fermenting and yeasts that stop near 1.004-1.000 seem to retain more apple flavor. I don't know that it's true, but I've heard that vigorous ferments "blow off" apple flavors.
That aside, I think your yeast selection and fermentation process is key to your flavor profile. Slower fermenting and yeasts that stop near 1.004-1.000 seem to retain more apple flavor. I don't know that it's true, but I've heard that vigorous ferments "blow off" apple flavors.
bmd2k1
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So do a freeze / thaw of plain juice like ya do for AJ?
madscientist451
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For more flavor, start with better juice and try to ferment low and slow.
Simply Apple makes a decent fermented cider but is a little more expensive. Maybe try a 1 gallon batch using that and WL002 yeast and see what you think.
venatorscribe
bucket chemist
Maybe - what you and your friends are looking for is a bit of a twist. By that I mean - what if you do a small infusion of dry hops. There are a number of hops that have a fruit salad tang about them that will give your taste buds a bit of a zing. Also - add some sugar prefermentation and up theABV by 1 or 2 %.
Yeah, that's the plan. Commercial concentrate tends to be "one dimensional", as they say. Dunno how many freeze/thaw cycles it'd take to duplicate fajc, the SG I get with the canned stuff is over my hydrometer's 1.16 max range.
RPh_Guy
Bringing Sour Back
Old Orchard FAJC is 1.198. I'm making a faux ice cider with it (diluted to 1.140) so I'm hoping it turns out all right. ... It's like $300/gal for the real stuff so I'll take my chances for $15.
Commercial FAJC is boiled to remove the water. Probably why it's not so great.
Commercial FAJC is boiled to remove the water. Probably why it's not so great.
bmd2k1
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U gotta hydrometer that goes up that high??
RPh_Guy
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I did a 50% dilution which read 1.099
The juice has a great spiciness to it and plenty of acidity, which I like.
bmd2k1
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Was just curious since only time I measured it was off my hydrometer scale.....I use Krogers FAJC all the time upfront in my regular & faux ice ciders.....its been great!
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I used "home made" FAJC this year in a few batches. My ciders are made from pressed juice from our own apples, but I imagine this would also work with "store bought" juice.
Freeze the juice in ice cube trays, then when you want it just put the cubes in a strainer and let the juice drip out as the juice component thaws and runs out before the water component, giving you a juice concentrate. It is a bit like sucking the juice out of an ice block when you were a kid.
It is a bit of a judgement call regarding when to stop thawing, but I ended up with a concentrate of around SG 1.150 ( measured with a refractometer). Conveniently this is around the same as 1:2 sugar/water mix (i.e. 1/3 sugar: 2/3 water), so you can bulk the concentrated juice up a bit if you don't quite get enough.
I used this to prime a batch fermented with SO4 which was stable at just above 1.000 after three months in secondary (our Fall is March-May). It was primed up to 1.004 and now that we are into Spring I have just opened the first of these after another couple of months in the bottle.... Yum, petillant carbonation and nice apple notes!
Freeze the juice in ice cube trays, then when you want it just put the cubes in a strainer and let the juice drip out as the juice component thaws and runs out before the water component, giving you a juice concentrate. It is a bit like sucking the juice out of an ice block when you were a kid.
It is a bit of a judgement call regarding when to stop thawing, but I ended up with a concentrate of around SG 1.150 ( measured with a refractometer). Conveniently this is around the same as 1:2 sugar/water mix (i.e. 1/3 sugar: 2/3 water), so you can bulk the concentrated juice up a bit if you don't quite get enough.
I used this to prime a batch fermented with SO4 which was stable at just above 1.000 after three months in secondary (our Fall is March-May). It was primed up to 1.004 and now that we are into Spring I have just opened the first of these after another couple of months in the bottle.... Yum, petillant carbonation and nice apple notes!
Silver79
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That bulk pricing is a negligible savings from old orchard. At the occasional sale price of 1.19 per can of frozen variety, 5 gals costs 63.07. no shipping. pick it up when you want at a big box store.
I love their fajc, but couldn't justify the shipping one state over for $34. Putting 5 gals at $94 to my door.
I love their fajc, but couldn't justify the shipping one state over for $34. Putting 5 gals at $94 to my door.
GeneDaniels1963
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I have found Old Orchard to be a good brand. However, if you want a simple way to up your cider game, find some crab apples. I freeze them, crush them, then just add them to the ferment bucket. I use about 3 lbs in a 2 gal bucket. They make a huge difference in the complexity of the final product.
I collected 10+ lb last year and froze them, then slowly using them since. I find that I can use the same 3-4 lb of thawed fruit for two batches and still get a nice flavor kick.
Vintage Iron
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Just to clarify, are you adding this 3-4lbs to Old Orchard concentrate?
GeneDaniels1963
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in a 2 gal ferment bucket I use about 1.5 gal juice, 3 cans concentrate, and then the crushed crab apples. In the end you want a little room for the krausen, but more or less a full bucket.
How did that turn out? I'm really interested in doing something similar.
RPh_Guy
Bringing Sour Back
LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE.
I used 8g/gal rehydrated RHST, no nutrient, and fermented cool, low-mid 50s. Left in primary 5 months. Finished at 1.059. Cleared nicely. Sweet, tart, spicy, smooth. Great balance. Almost no alcohol taste, even at 13%. Need to be careful!
Added ~25ppm sulfite at bottling.
Going into my rotation so I always have some bottled. Might consider some oak cubes.
I was hoping for it to finish lower but it's great the way it is.
Cheers
bmd2k1
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Isn't that closer to 10.6% 1.14 to 1.059
RPh_Guy
Bringing Sour Back
I used a newer equation, available as "alternate" from BF, which supposedly is more accurate at higher gravities, and does seem more accurate in my experience when comparing finishing gravity to yeast alcohol tolerances.
https://www.brewersfriend.com/2011/06/16/alcohol-by-volume-calculator-updated/
Either way, it's a lovely cider.
bmd2k1
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Hmmm...interesting. [emoji111]I used a newer equation, available as "alternate" from BF, which supposedly is more accurate at higher gravities, and does seem more accurate in my experience when comparing finishing gravity to yeast alcohol tolerances.
https://www.brewersfriend.com/2011/06/16/alcohol-by-volume-calculator-updated/
Either way, it's a lovely cider.
Prost!
