Everyday Simplest Dry Cider

[kgressler]

You mentioned you're concerned about bottle bombs due to the CO2 in suspension. That Co2 is normal and expected, but if you let me know what your volume is, what temp your cider is at, and how much sugar is in your can of Concentrate, I can plug those in to a priming calculator and see if we can get you some reassurance.

Yeah the carbonation is quite strong when pouring it into a glass. When i put it in the gravity jar it was half an inch thick and stayed that way for a well over a min or 2. The other cider I did had very little carbonation when i poured it in the jar.

Not sure what you mean by the volume of the cider.

Its temperature has been a steady 58-60 just about the entire fermentation.
The concentrate I have is 29g per serving so 29x6=174g of sugar

 

[phug]

Yeah the carbonation is quite strong when pouring it into a glass. When i put it in the gravity jar it was half an inch thick and stayed that way for a well over a min or 2. The other cider I did had very little carbonation when i poured it in the jar.

Not sure what you mean by the volume of the cider.

Its temperature has been a steady 58-60 just about the entire fermentation.
The concentrate I have is 29g per serving so 29x6=174g of sugar

how many litres, or gallons of cider do you need to carbonate?

 

[phug]

Ok, so your apple juice concentrate does hold more sugar than I was anticipating. I think I'm noticing a trend with US based juice vs Canadian based juice.

so, If you have 5 gallons of cider and you are at 58 degress F, you want to add no more than 138G of sugar to hit 3 volumes of Co2. and unless you're using swingtop or belgian, or champagne bottles I don't recommend it.

So, you'll have to reduce your apple juice concentrate addition to %79 percent of what's in your can. Because this calculator factors in the CO2 in solution in your cider based on the temperature of your cider and the maximum amount of CO2 that is CAN actually hold while under pressure, you don't have to worry about it.

so if your can is 12oz, the only add 9.5 oz of your AJC


Edit: You mentioned your plan was to add 3/4 of the can, that should be a pretty good amount for you, or you could use plastic bottles as you mentioned, and you would be fine.

your 3/4 can addition should give you 2.8 vols of C02, and the whole can would give you 3.5 volumes which is belgian/hefeweizen territory

 

[kgressler]

Ok, so your apple juice concentrate does hold more sugar than I was anticipating. I think I'm noticing a trend with US based juice vs Canadian based juice.

so, If you have 5 gallons of cider and you are at 58 degress F, you want to add no more than 138G of sugar to hit 3 volumes of Co2. and unless you're using swingtop or belgian, or champagne bottles I don't recommend it.

So, you'll have to reduce your apple juice concentrate addition to %79 percent of what's in your can. Because this calculator factors in the CO2 in solution in your cider based on the temperature of your cider and the maximum amount of CO2 that is CAN actually hold while under pressure, you don't have to worry about it.

so if your can is 12oz, the only add 9.5 oz of your AJC


Edit: You mentioned your plan was to add 3/4 of the can, that should be a pretty good amount for you, or you could use plastic bottles as you mentioned, and you would be fine.

your 3/4 can addition should give you 2.8 vols of C02, and the whole can would give you 3.5 volumes which is belgian/hefeweizen territory

I started with about 5 gallons once I racked it and ive taken samples twice Im sure I am some where near 4.5 to 4.75 gallons.

I think my plan is to do my first batch with mostly plastic soda bottles just in case. Since this is my first time I think it just makes more sense at this point. Maybe bottle a few just as a test so i can get used to bottling.

 

[phug]

as an added suggestion. try practicing bottling using straight water before you start on your cider. That'll show you where the tricky bits are, and you don't have to worry about wasting cider.

 

[graycobra]

Also make sure the spigot is turned off before you begin racking into your bucket. That's an embarrassing one for me. Lol

I've used a full can of treetop to prime both Graff and this, carbonation was fine in the cider, too much in the Graff. Not gushers or bottle bombs in either case

 

[kgressler]

as an added suggestion. try practicing bottling using straight water before you start on your cider. That'll show you where the tricky bits are, and you don't have to worry about wasting cider.

Alright well I got it all bottled up. Actually I only used glass on 13 bottles the rest were plastic soda bottles.
I put the glass bottles inside a 12 pack box then inside a igloo cooler and set it down stairs. The plastic I just put in a spare room. I'll keep a check on them each day.

We'll see how it goes.

 

[kgressler]

Also make sure the spigot is turned off before you begin racking into your bucket. That's an embarrassing one for me. Lol
e

Ha yeah I can imagine. lol

 

[phug]

see you in 3-4 weeks kgressler.
anecdotal reports you may see slightly difference carb levels in plastic v glass, due to the plastic flexing. we'll have to wait and see, and I don't think the difference has ever been a whole heck of a lot.

 

[TheCADJockey]

Being this is week 3 for my cider, I said funk it... I am taking a half day. I'm going home and bottling my beer and I will then transfer my cider into the fermenter the beer was in for the final week. I will test and sample it during transfer and report back in a few hours. The fourth week will mean I get to bottle it around New Years so that will be nice.

 

[kgressler]

see you in 3-4 weeks kgressler.
anecdotal reports you may see slightly difference carb levels in plastic v glass, due to the plastic flexing. we'll have to wait and see, and I don't think the difference has ever been a whole heck of a lot.

The area I am keeping my bottles in is still pretty cool (60-64) So It may take some time for any carbonation to build. I really dont have a place to put them that is much warmer without worrying about a huge mess if I do get a bomb. I checked them this morning and I didnt notice any real difference in the hardness of the bottles. But each day I will give them a squeeze.

 

[phug]

what I have done in the past to warm up bottle to carb faster, not my idea, but taken from others. Place your bottles in a cardboard box, or cooler, and then run a string of incandesent christmas lights into the box and turn them on.

you may have to take some lights out of the box, and hang them outside the box to maintain the temp you want.

 

[kgressler]

Phug,

So can I expect any apple flavor to come back in such a short time. You mentioned 3-4 week conditioning time line. Seems really short. I have read many people going 6-8 months. My wife tasted it before bottling and said she liked it because she likes dry wine as I do but I would hope to see some apple flavor return. Just curious of you had any you left to condition longer.

 

[phug]

the 3-4 weeks is really only for full carbonation, and I can say that I do enjoy it at that point. I have some in the basement that I bottled maybe 2-3 months ago, I can crack one tonight, and let you know where it stands.

You'll probably get a small amount back after the 3-4 weeks of conditioning, but it won't be slap you in the face apple, but I guarantee it will taste different than it did on bottling day. And if the wife liked it, then at the very least you have a recipe that you can come back to that she'll be happy with.

 

[kgressler]

Yeah definitely dont want a strong apple flavor. I want it to lean more towards wine then cider.
Whenever you do open one I would love to hear what you think.

Thanks again phug!

 

[phug]

Ok went back to my notes kicked off my last batch 7/17. Had a bottle with dinner tonight. Light bodied, apple flavour is there but mild, almost like apple juice that's been watered down a ways. Definitely more apple cider than wine. Don't ask me on aroma, my nose doesn't work fantastically well. The tartness ha also mellowed nicely

 

[TheCADJockey]

Hey guys. My cider looks like it's going to finish around 1.002 but I'm going to give it a couple more days to make sure. It is beautifully clear, racked it once just now for the last couple days so I could clean up my Carboy. I have a quick question though. . I just tasted a cup of it. I wanted more. It tastes amazing. Um. In couple days when I go to bottle, would it be stupid to fill a tall swing top as is? It's so good right now. Would it just be like an apple wine or something?

 

[MarkKF]

I just tasted a cup of it. I wanted more. It tastes amazing. Um. In couple days when I go to bottle, would it be stupid to fill a tall swing top as is? It's so good right now. Would it just be like an apple wine or something?

Good idea. Its what I do. I filled a 64 oz. growler last time I bottled and drank it the next day (still).

 

[phug]

You absolutely can bottle some of it straight with no carbonation. If you like it do it. Just remember to factor that in when you calculate the volume of cider that you will be carbing.

Congrats cadjockey,

 

[s361673]

Im very interested in trying this recipe. I have a supply of White Labs London Ale yeast that I recovered from a previous fermentation. Can I use it with this recipe?

 

[phug]

You should be good to go, if that London ale yeast behaves anything like s-04 the only thing I would caution is to keep an eye on your fermentation temps, and that it might not ferment all the way down to 1.000. Other than that everything else would probably stay the same.

 

[phug]

You may need to chill it to near freezing if using wlp013 to get the yeast to drop out of suspension when fermentation is done. Somewhere south of 4c

 

[kgressler]

Ok went back to my notes kicked off my last batch 7/17. Had a bottle with dinner tonight. Light bodied, apple flavour is there but mild, almost like apple juice that's been watered down a ways. Definitely more apple cider than wine. Don't ask me on aroma, my nose doesn't work fantastically well. The tartness ha also mellowed nicely

Opened a glass bottle today and had a slight carb...small hiss when I opened poured it in a glass didn't have any real head at all but did have some around the outside of the glass.
Was pretty darn dry that's for sure. Maybe a bit too dry for my liking. Added a small bit of left over cider to sweeten it a bit and it definitely helped take some of the bite out of it.
Started this in Nov 25 and it's only been bottled I believe 2 weeks or so. I'll give it another month and see if it helps.

 

[phug]

I'm generally unhappy with mine at two weeks after bottling and find it's not yet carbed fully, there's hope yet. Though the part about it being dry won't change

 

[graycobra]

I've been using mine for snakebites. Mixed with a nice wheat ale, adds a little sweetness.

 

[s361673]

You should be good to go, if that London ale yeast behaves anything like s-04 the only thing I would caution is to keep an eye on your fermentation temps, and that it might not ferment all the way down to 1.000. Other than that everything else would probably stay the same.

Can you be more specific about controlling the fermentation temperature(s)? What range(s) should I target? What are the consequences if the fermentation process gets too warm or cold?

 

[MarkKF]

Every yeast has a published temp. range. Get to lose to the bottom of that range and fermentation slows or stalls. Too close to the top of that range and you can get off flavors and odors. Most yeast used in cider making likes the 60's.

 

[TheCADJockey]

I'm going to bottle ours tonight or tomorrow. Would it be cool to put half in the little 2.5 gal keg I just got? The last sample I took tasted so great I don't even know if I want to leave the carbonation up to the frozen concentrate.

 

[phug]

I'm going to bottle ours tonight or tomorrow. Would it be cool to put half in the little 2.5 gal keg I just got? The last sample I took tasted so great I don't even know if I want to leave the carbonation up to the frozen concentrate.

Go for it!

 

[TheCADJockey]

So we ran into some pressing matters over the holidays that did not allow us to bottle our cider. We have made plans to do it tonight. We have decided to put half of it in the keg, but as far as the other half goes... we definitely want some of it uncarbed as is because it tastes so nice. Should we just put half in the keg, and half in wine bottles and flip tops uncarbed instead of worrying about priming a small amount? Since it is fermented dry, I don't need to add anything when I put it in the keg right... I can just add it and put the gas on?

 

[phug]

Right on both counts, though for regular wine bottles you may want to degas it somewhat or periodically crack the bottles if using screw caps. You'll still have some carb in those and wine bottles are not super duper pressure friendly

 

[kgressler]

View attachment ImageUploadedByHome Brew1421531540.295923.jpgView attachment ImageUploadedByHome Brew1421531555.498419.jpg

Well it's been bottled for about a month.
Popped another bottle and the carb is pretty much perfect. Same as it was a few weeks ago so I guess it pretty stable.
Still very much wine like dry and tart.
Not quite what I am looking for to be honest not bad just a little drier then I prefer.
So I cheated and put a spoon full of sugar in and it was perfect.
I guess as much as I enjoy a dry white wine. My cider just needs more sweetness to it then I thought.
I do think I will give this another shot just with fresh cider next season to see if it's improved from cheap store bought.

Edit I think I can attribute a lot of that tartness to the cranberry that you warned me about phug.

 

[phug]

I'm sorry it didn't turn out to be quite what you expected, but I'm glad it wasn't a total flop either.

Regarding the dryness, I don't think anyone can accuse me of false advertising.

 

[MarkKF]

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Edit I think I can attribute a lot of that tartness to the cranberry that you warned me about phug.

It sure looks good. Tart is nice too.

 

[Silentdrinker]

A spoon full of sugar helps the cider go down.

Damn, just the motivation I meed. I have 6 gal I've been ignoring. It's been lagering in the basement with the cold weather. I need to get it over to another keg, sweetened a little and dry hopped.

 

[kgressler]

I'm sorry it didn't turn out to be quite what you expected, but I'm glad it wasn't a total flop either.

Regarding the dryness, I don't think anyone can accuse me of false advertising.

No need to say sorry. I wanted a dry cider. That's what I got!
I hate sweet cider like angry orchard. Way too sweet for me.
Thought this is what I was looking for.
I think I need something just a bit less dry.
It definitely wasn't a flop my wife likes it so it won't go to waste that's for sure.
It was a great learning experience,
It's pretty cool making my own cider and I look forward to making more.

 

[kgressler]

It sure looks good. Tart is nice too.

Thanks Mark

 

[TheCADJockey]

I forwarded this recipe to my brother, he wants to make it... but he is going away. Would it be okay for him to primary for required time, rack it to secondary and come back to it almost 2 months later? I wasn't sure what to tell him, if there would be any ill-effects from having it that long without bottles.

 

[phug]

It should e fine as long as he makes sure he's got very little headspace in secondary. Either by adding an extra litre or two in primary or by topping up the secondary with water or what have you.

Or he could go straight to bottles after a month in primary.

 

[MarkKF]

Thanks Mark

Like the counter backsplash too

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P. S. I just tried s little Xylitol for back sweeten.